9 replies to this topic

[Thinker]

There is something heart-wrenching about an old church that has been abandoned. Many of the people who worshipped in them had a wonderful heritage of faithfulness to the Word of God, but something happened and now those who once sat in the pews have died or moved on. Even more tragic is when these old buildings, once dedicated to God, have come to house some cult or false religion or maybe have become a museum or antique store. However, it is far more tragic when those who profess to be born again become spiritually sterile and the light dims because the Holy Spirit has abandoned or greatly diminished the manifestation of His Power in their midst. There may be a few remaining sparks but the flame of passionate love for and worship of God has, for the most part, cooled and died down to ashes. The sparks finally succumb and fade out altogether. Nevertheless, those sparks could be re-ignited if even one or two of those sparks responded to the One Who said, "Nevertheless, I have somewhat against thee, because thou hast left thy first love" (Revelation 2:4). They had much history that merited His approval but they had left their first love. His answer for their dying devotion is found in Verse 5. There, He admonished, "Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and repent, and do the first works; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, except thou repent." How those sparks might be ignited will engage our attention tomorrow, God willing. Selah! A body and a church when abandoned have much in common!  Thinker  (Ron)

[elizabethcog]

How true your ,and God'sWord rings,what are we to do when we feel the cooling and we do feel it in every sense God gave us....Stop and repent and seek God He is still there and He will complete the mighty work He started...thanks Thinker I now will ponder these things in my heart,great food dor thought and prayer

[ADVRider]

Ron,

 

I agree it is especially tragic when believers lose their first love and move away from the Savior. It is also sad to see empty churches that were once vibrant places of worship. Yet, there are also those churches that seem to be the opposite; they are filled with thousands of people, but there is not that much in the way of true worship of the Lord or even biblical understanding. That is, they have become mostly social centers, largely revolving around a self-help, feel-good message of one sort or another. BTW, I am not against inspirational, encouraging messages at all, but just contrasting this type of church with all the empty churches that were once alive with the Spirit. And yet I see a third dimension. Tens of thousands of sincere believers who have left "the church," but who have not left the Body of Christ. This is controversial I know, espescially as you are a pastor in a traditional setting, but all these are not necessarily backslidden or cold. In many cases, they are now isolated and with no fellowship; not good for sure. But some of these are fellowshipping in other ways, house churches, etc. Some would consider this also not good or "not quite the same."

 

I suspect many believers, both attendees of, and non-attendees of, a traditional church setting are thirsty for biblical Christianity to be fleshed-out. Truthfully, many I've spoken with are tired of "church" and feel they are just going through the motions. I think you have dialogued with a few people like that on this very site. At the very least, they struggle to find a "home," yet they love the Lord. So, is it them? Or are there possibly other things at play as well? 

 

I certainly don't have all the answers, but the reasons people have left the church in our time, I think, are complicated and many. One is some folks have come to the idea that there is more than one way of doing church; that it can look different and be different than what we have thought. I don't think there has been much discussion on this topic in the body of Christ, other than perhaps a few authors, and it is of course uncomfortable to think a traditional way of doing things might not be the only way. But we should be open to having the discussion because as you are pointing out, many people have left the church in recent years. We should maybe not assume they have all left the Faith. And if not, we should be asking some other questions about why we do what we have been doing. This also speaks to why new people don't or won't come to a traditional church. These are questions we should all be asking; because some Christians have pondered and gone a different way. It would be good to find out why. I have more thoughts on it, but this is enough for now.

[chipped china]

John,

Thank you for your clarity of why some people have moved away from churches. It describes me quite well. Jesus speaks of the Laodicean church as one that He is knocking on the door because He's on the outside trying to get in. Church buildings are full of nice people but I have trouble finding the ones who are all consumed with finding the scent of Christ in each other. I personally am learning so much from the bible and audio tapes that I want to explore my thoughts, revelations and confusion with other believers. I find that in my small bible study but not at the church service. Maybe church service is just for glorifying God in a group setting, where hopefully the Holy Spirit is alive and feeding us, but I'd rather spend time in an intimate setting, sharing testimony, praying, explaining what God has been teaching us, sharing burdens, and glorifying God. I want to experience agape love working through me to others. To love God and others we have to become intimate and transparent with each other. When you have a spouse and family maybe that's enough for you but for me who lives alone it's not. Sometimes I get depressed about it and kind of give up because we are all so busy filling up our lives with stuff, going here, doing that, work work work. We are suppose to be the Body of Christ and that means knowing each others gifts, weaknesses, joys and sorrow. How can that happen when we only spend one or two hours together a week?

 

As you can see "self " still plays a large part of my life, forgive me Lord, brothers and sisters, I just want what God wants for us.

[ADVRider]

John,

Thank you for your clarity of why some people have moved away from churches. It describes me quite well. Jesus speaks of the Laodicean church as one that He is knocking on the door because He's on the outside trying to get in. Church buildings are full of nice people but I have trouble finding the ones who are all consumed with finding the scent of Christ in each other. I personally am learning so much from the bible and audio tapes that I want to explore my thoughts, revelations and confusion with other believers. I find that in my small bible study but not at the church service. Maybe church service is just for glorifying God in a group setting, where hopefully the Holy Spirit is alive and feeding us, but I'd rather spend time in an intimate setting, sharing testimony, praying, explaining what God has been teaching us, sharing burdens, and glorifying God. I want to experience agape love working through me to others. To love God and others we have to become intimate and transparent with each other. When you have a spouse and family maybe that's enough for you but for me who lives alone it's not. Sometimes I get depressed about it and kind of give up because we are all so busy filling up our lives with stuff, going here, doing that, work work work. We are suppose to be the Body of Christ and that means knowing each others gifts, weaknesses, joys and sorrow. How can that happen when we only spend one or two hours together a week?

 

As you can see "self " still plays a large part of my life, forgive me Lord, brothers and sisters, I just want what God wants for us.

 

 

Dear Chipped (Laurie?),

 

I think you are on it when you describe the intimate setting where you can be an expression of Christ. I started-off in a real small church where we had this kind of intimacy in the church building, during and after the services. It's not the location that matters as much as the environment, spiritually speaking. Many congregations and traditions do not really make room for this or create an environment where the whole body can function. And the larger churches, well, it isn't going to happen in most cases. But there are exceptions.  If I were called to be a pastor, I'd want small.

 

I have to believe though that Jesus spent more time imparting His life to the 12 than he did in the Temple and the synagogue combined. Just my guess.

[chipped china]

my name is Betsy

[ADVRider]

my name is Betsy

 

Doh,

 

I knew that. Kind of; I just haven't been around in a while, but I sort of remembered it ended in the -ie sound. Sorry I got it wrong.

[Candice]

John Albert - I'm glad you're back.  Missed you!

[chipped china]

You're forgiven Jake, lol

[ADVRider]

John Albert - I'm glad you're back.  Missed you!

Thanks Candice.