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Do You Hate the Truth?


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#21 Charles Miles

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Posted 13 October 2017 - 06:19 PM

I am actually stunned. Hearing any mortal man tell me he does not sin is just wayyyy out there. I have known some pretty good folks over the years(Billy Graham comes to mind), and none have ever even suggested that they did not sin. Yes, we have forgiveness if we ask for it, and we should but for one to say he does not ever think wrong, speak wrong, run a stop sign, speed, shade the truth.....well very good. Having not sinned, you must expect a very high seat in heaven. In fact, there would be only one other person on that seat with you.

Peace be to you brother
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#22 Candice

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Posted 13 October 2017 - 08:49 PM

Our Lord Jesus is gracious and FULL of compassion (Ps 111:4).

#23 ADVRider

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Posted 14 October 2017 - 09:19 AM

I am actually stunned. Hearing any mortal man tell me he does not sin is just wayyyy out there. I have known some pretty good folks over the years(Billy Graham comes to mind), and none have ever even suggested that they did not sin. Yes, we have forgiveness if we ask for it, and we should but for one to say he does not ever think wrong, speak wrong, run a stop sign, speed, shade the truth.....well very good. Having not sinned, you must expect a very high seat in heaven. In fact, there would be only one other person on that seat with you.
Peace be to you brother

This is where I was going with my question, "is any human perfect" in the here and now? I thought it should be obvious we are not. We are all still capable of mistakes, sins and other forms of the Adamic nature. Yes, we have been delivered and are being continually delivered as we follow the Lord, but no human is fully like Jesus 100%, 100% of the time. Even the Lord knows we are flawed and He isn't expecting human perfection; He looks upon the heart and expects our love and obedience, which is not the same as human perfection. To think otherwise is to turn the whole of scripture on its head and devolve fully into the law. THIS, is the insult to the Father and The Spirit of grace who sent His Son to do that which we could not. It is also putting on people, a yoke of bondage to the law, which can never set people free. If a man has "arrived" in this life, he no longer needs the grace and forgiveness of God. It's abundantly clear we are not 100% set free from Adam until the resurrection of the body. In this life, there are lapses and that is why God calls for repentance. When the glorious day comes, that will be over. The answer to cheap grace is not legalism, it's love, contrition and repentance and restoration to the Father. This restoration is still not perfection, until it is, at the resurrection.


Edited by ADVRider, 15 October 2017 - 09:02 PM.

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#24 Candice

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Posted 14 October 2017 - 09:46 AM

ADVRider,
I would triple like this reply if it were possible!

I posted reply of what is reality to our Father as He only sees His “PERFECT” Son; not me.

His reality needs to be mine or I’d follow the legalism road, as you state so well
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#25 Big John

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Posted 14 October 2017 - 05:49 PM

I will simply share a couple of my very favorite scriptures.

 

Rev 3

19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

Or the way I see it.  If I love you, I am going correct you and give you a whippin as is needed.  So, just get over it, and GO FOR IT and when you miss the mark (as you know you will), REPENT (dust yerself off and Get after it again).

 

Also

Malachi 3

And he shall sit as a refiner and purifier of silver: and he shall purify the sons of Levi, and purge them as gold and silver, that they may offer unto the Lordan offering in righteousness.

As God is raising up kings and priests this scripture applies to christians.

 

God is purifying His children.


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#26 Charles Miles

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Posted 15 October 2017 - 05:30 AM

Absolutely AV and John,  If we still live on this earth we are not fully sanctified to the perfect life.  We continue to obey and do as the Lord would have us, but we ALL miss the mark on occasion. We as children of God do not lose our sonship, but we can get "out of favor with God" and that is a pitiful way to live a life. 

 As we accept what Jesus did for us and we put on God`s own righteousness, yes, God sees us as His children. but as I understand it, we are guiltless as the Father sees the "finished product" of Jesus`s work. God may see us as perfect, and that is the best of news, but we know we still miss the mark on a daily basis. Only by the grace of God and His love does He continue to work with us, forgive us, and allow us to remain in His household. 

 When a man/woman/human tells me that they do not sin, at all, ever, then that puts them in a special class, they are either not telling the truth or I`m speaking to Jesus. How to tell the difference? Observe.  

We should always avoid sin, try never to sin, but still ask to be forgiven for those sins we know in our heart that we do commit. Yes, I plan to be in heaven, sing with the saints, and want to have a crown to cast down before Him, but it will never be that way because I do not sin and have not ever sinned. I will be there because God forgives my sin through the shed blood of Jesus. If God ever told me that I was free of sin and could enter heaven right now, but He would no longer forgive my sin after today, and oh, by the way, you have to live another year here on earth.........that would not be good.  Thank God that is not what happens....He tells me I am His and I am in His hand. He also tells me He has NEVER lost anyone who was in His hand. The causes peace in the soul

 

I pray that everyone accepts the offer of the Father to let Him hold them in His hand....it is a very, very safe place...

 

Charlie


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#27 Justin

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Posted 23 October 2017 - 08:08 AM

TKulp,

 

Wow. Do you know and love the truth? Here it is. 

 

 If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we say we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us. 1 John 1:8-10


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#28 Tkulp

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Posted 15 December 2017 - 08:04 AM

Justin,

 

I feel like it is time for me to publicly respond to your post in this forum. The attention that it drew and the comments that were made, really, kind of went wild. I was reading over many of the comments, from this forum, finding them rather interesting, sadly so.

 

I do know and love the Truth, but the "Truth is not found in a few sentences out of a entire letter! You will never begin to know the heart of a writer until you have read all that they have written.

 

A question comes to mind as I read your post from 1 John. Do you and the other posters read and post about what you have read and learned from the Holy Spirit, as you have study His Word, or are you just repeating what you have learned from the teachings of man? ....from books, commentaries, preachers, etc.?

 

Justin, you have quoted a scripture from 1 John, but your understanding of that verse does not agree with the rest of what the letter of 1 John says, or the thoughts of the entire writings of John, including the Gospel of John.

 

When these letters were written there were no chapters and verses numbers to confuse or interrupt the context(message) of what the writer was proclaiming to the recipients of that entire letter.

 

Yes, all have sinned. That is what the word says and John was establishing that fact, as he started his letter. If you say that sin was never a part of your life, you are not telling the truth. Now go on from the past into the present and future with the Spirit of Christ living within you body, for real!

 

In the rest of the letter he clearly states how that changes when Jesus Christ's Spirit comes to truly, with the evidences of a changed life (the fruit/how you act, talk, etc.), live inside the human shell of clay. The teachings of the entire New Testament talk about this miracle and what an individual that has received the miracle will look and live, inside and out.

 

Adam sinned, so all that are born of the human race are bound by the nature of selfishness and rebellion; sin. Doing it my way and not God's way!

 

Jesus was born of the Holy Spirit, He did not have that bondage. He was born as Adam was created, pure and holy, in the image of God. Jesus lived His entire life, free from disobedience, demonstrating that we can follow His example, "if" we have the same Spirit living with in us and in control of our lives; "if" we are truly born again, as Adam was created and Jesus was born; free form the sin nature. We are to be grafted into the vine, Jesus Christ, with His nourishment daily and continually feeding and directing our spirit.

 

Chapter 2 of 1 John tells us that Jesus knows the struggle it is for a human to live completely and fully under the control of the Spirit, as He did. If we should mess up and miss the mark He steps in and defends us before the Father. This is not a regular or expected occurrence, like taking a bath every day to stay clean. This is a rare happening.

 

"(My little children, I am writing these things to you so that you may not sin.)" You can read and ask the Holy Spirit to open you eyes to see what the rest of the letter is saying, but this what John said, regarding sin and what you are if you continue to live in sin.

 

In the third chapter, John continues by saying,  "And everyone who has this hope focused on him purifies himself, just as Jesus is pure). Everyone who practices sin also practices lawlessness; indeed, sin is lawlessness.  And you know that Jesus was revealed to take away sins, and in him there is no sinEveryone who resides in him does not sin; everyone who sins has neither seen him nor known him."

 

When I read the letter of 1 John I do not try to understand it in the framework of my past sinful humanity. I want to understand it as John believed it, lived it and was attempting to defend "the faith", the true gospel message. I refuse to accept man's  attempt to explain away the "Truth" with big confusing and misunderstood words.

 

As the Gospel of John says in chapter 15, if an individual is grafted into the vine, Jesus Christ, and remains in Him, their life will produce grapes, (that is the pure fruit that a grape vine is naturally supposed to produce), with out effort, by feeding and living off of the sap (the Spirit of Christ) from the vine.  If they do not remain in Christ, the vine, they will not produce fruit and will eventually become separated, gathered and burned. If they remain in Him and produce fruit, they will be pruned to produce more and better fruit.

 

What John is writing here is not the idea that Jesus or His Spirit is covering or coloring a sinful life, so that God will not see what kind of rotten fruit is  really being produced. God always sees us as we are on the inside before it even becomes words or actions!

 

John is writing about an individual that is really living in Jesus and Jesus living in them. They have put the self-life to death and are continually submitting to His promptings. What they hear from the Holy Spirit they obey.

 

If they do not obey, they sin, they do not produce grapes (righteousness that He is prompting to be done), They are not remaining attached to the vine, as the vine only produces good fruit. Without the sap(the Spirit of Christ), they will eventually dry up, and at some point they will become separated from the vine, gathered up and burned. Good fruit can only be produced while an individual remains in (attached to) the vine, Jesus Christ!

 

When His righteousness is really in me, I will look like Him. I will truly be able to say that it is not me. Without Him I can do nothing, similar to what Jesus always said in regard to the Father. He only did what the Father gave Him. The Father lived within Him the same way that Jesus is to live within a true Christian.  John 17:16-23, John 17:21

 

Most all the books of the New Testament share the concept of attaining what is translated as the English word, perfection.

Perfect  is defined by Strong's Greek Dictionary as being " complete (in various applications of labor, growth, mental and moral character, etc.)"

 

Being without sin, after the Holy Spirit is given control, is not a suggestion in the Bible. God in His Word has made it a command. If it were not possible than it would not be in the Bible. The Holy Spirit can not sin, if we always obey Him we will not sin. We only sin when the flesh and self are in control.

 

Matthew 5:48  Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

 

This is not just me or my beliefs, that you may choose to disagree with; this is the Word of God, in context. If you do not agree with this you have made your choice before God, not me. You are His kid until He says otherwise. I am being obedient to Him. I will have to answer to Him for any disobedience or discoloring of what He has shown me and prompted me to share.

 

No matter what, I would encourage you to stop reading books that explain away Scripture and all commentaries that do the same. Some may be good, while others may be bad. Either way they are mostly man's thoughts. The Bible says, if you read the Bible to learn and grow, that the Holy Spirit will be our teacher. I do not say that to encourage you to be a 'lone wolf'. That is a false and dangerous idea. We need each other, but we need to be taught by the Holy Spirit, so we can encourage and reprove those within the body of Christ, in 'Truth', not in error.

 

As I have obeyed the promptings of the Holy Spirit, He has been faithful to provide devotionals from men of God written 50 to 100 years ago, to be a witness and confirmation of the "Truth". So again it was today. He prompted me to read the follow devotional.  I was to add it to this post as I finalized what I have been several days in preparing, making sure that it contains accurately the Truth of the Word.

 

The spirit of anti-Christ is very powerful in the world today! Satan is masquerading as an angel of 'light', deceiving many who do not have the Holy Spirit as their internal teacher and source of "Light".

 

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Our Daily Walk                       by F.B. Meyer                December 14

 

COMMUNION AND TRANSFORMATION

 

"Moses wist not that the skin of his face shone while he talked with Him."-- Exo_34:29.

 

"We all, with unveiled face reflecting as a mirror the glory of the Lord, are transformed into the same image."-- 2Co_3:18.

 

MOSES, AS he returned from the mountain of vision, where he had beheld as much of God's glory as seems possible to man, caught some gleam of the Light which he beheld. There was a strange radiance on his face, unknown to himself, but visible to all. He remained long enough in the presence of God to become saturated with the light and glory of the Lord. What wonder that he sparkled with it and was compelled to cover his face with a veil!

 

St. Paul refers to this incident, and shows that the light which shone upon the face of Moses is the symbol of the lustre of character which shines from those who behold or reflect the glory of the Lord. As we behold the glory shining in the face of Jesus Christ, we are changed into His likeness.

 

There are two laws for Christian living: keep looking at Jesus until you become like Him, and beholding are changed into the same image; then reflect Him to others, and as you endeavour to reflect Him, the work of transformation goes on. "Tell me the company a man keeps, and I will tell you his character"; so runs the old proverb. We might go further and say, tell us what are the subjects of his habitual consideration--art, literature, theology, law, commerce, philanthropy--and we shall be able to anticipate the expression that will come upon his face.

 

If we desire to be pure and good, Christ-like and God like, we must live in fellowship with Christ; beholding and reflecting His glory, even the lowliest and most sinful may become changed into His image. How different to Moses is the unveiled glory of Christ. Let us beware of anything that might bring a veil between Him and us, and nothing will so soon do this as sin, and inconsistency. Moses wist not that his face shone, and Samson wist not that the Lord had departed from him (Jdg_16:20). There is a tragic as well as a blessed unconsciousness. Let us see to it that we watch and pray, that we may not be taken unawares, and deprived of our purity and strength whilst wrapt in unconsciousness.

 

PRAYER

We long to be holy as Thou art holy; to love as Christ also loved us; to be patient and unmurmuring as He was, and so to resemble Him that men may love Him for what they see of His likeness in us. AMEN.

 

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When I accepted Jesus into my life I began to hear and obey His voice, His Word.%