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Today's Tozer's devotional


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#1 chipped china

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Posted 16 December 2012 - 06:42 PM

http://www.cmallianc...devotions/tozer

It's true only God can exalt or bring down a man. And we all have been shaped by certain prophets. I don't just mean the ones in the Bible who were in direct communion with God and spoke outcomes and warnings to people. I mean the ones who God chooses right now to bring the fuller meaning of the Word to us. God shapes us through these people, the ones who ring true and the ones we reject. Why is it that certain prophets sing a song of God in our hearts and others are just good food? I know there is some controversy (or was) surrounding Watchman Nee. Was he a mystic and is that bad? All I know is He helped me have a closer relationship with my Lord and Savior by helping me understand my soul is separate from my spirit. My soul and it's earthly needs can yield to the Spirit in me. Nee's knowledge worked for me, I've never been so on fire to know my Lord and share Him.

I wonder if I don't belong on this site because it belongs to CMA and their beliefs? I realize this is a critical statement and if I offended please accept my apology. I believe in the Word, I look for the sheep who are one mind in Christ whether at the grocery store, my local church or this site. I hunger and thirst for my Savior in others. I have felt God's Spirit, I've felt His Holiness and it is supernatural, mystical. It's not me it's Him. It's what I call a glimpse of heaven here on earth. I want to share it with others so they really know the love and majesty of our Omni-everything God. We must be diligent and preserve to find the deeper life. I think this happens by being transparent so we can be shown the Truth. God choose not only Job, Noah, and Tozer but Paul, John the Baptist, Brennan Manning and Watchman Nee. We have all come from different backgrounds and have experienced different things. God decides when we are ready for a new truth and who we will deliver that message.

Thank you Lord for the good prophets you send to guide us so we may glorify Your Name! I ask in Jesus name that you will bless the missionaries good works in other countries and here in America. And I pray that the awful things happening here and abroad will cause people to repent and look to you. I pray Lord you give us strength to boldly proclaim the Truth and fight against princes and principalities of darkness. Lord, we know through prophesy that end is getting near. Please help us be ready with Your strength for whatever you ask us to do. Amen
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#2 Kevin Blankenship

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Posted 16 December 2012 - 07:12 PM

Tozer, supposedly, and if my info is right, was also a Christian mystic, and many of the writer's he loved were considered Christian mystics. He quoted many of them. Bernard of Clairvaux , Brother Lawrence ( The Practice of the Presence of God), and the writer or The Imitation of Christ (can't remember his name at the moment).
So i feel that you should be more at home here than about anywhere, Forum-wise.
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#3 Lori Smith

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Posted 17 December 2012 - 02:26 PM

Betsy,

I think this is a great topic, and I will answer based on my own experience. Many of the prophets that receive much of the notoriety on T. V. (the super prophets that Kevin mentioned), don't ring true in my heart. I think it is because their hearts are wrong. I think some may truly have prophetic gifts, while most of them don't.

Then there are others like Tozer, who bring a waterfall of refreshment to the spirit. They are mystical in the sense that they are in touch with God, and God's presence is felt in their words. It's the same with some music. I think some of these might even be a bit quirky but there is still a wonderful sense of God's presence in their words because their hearts are right, and there are no deceitful motives in them.

Then I think we can distinguish between those who truly have a prophetic gift, and those who simply hear revelations from God because they are in touch with Him on a regular basis.

That's been my experience anyway.

Blessings,
Lori
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In The Pursuit of God, A. W. Tozer writes, "Jesus taught that He wrought His works by always keeping His inward eyes upon His Father. His power lay in His continuous look at God (John 5:19-21)."

#4 chipped china

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Posted 17 December 2012 - 03:26 PM

Yes, I believe what you say and I thank God he has given me some discernment. I listen to Christian radio much more than Christian TV but there a few good pastors I watch like Charles Stanley.

I also listen to Chris Rice music a lot. I believe he is anointed by God.

Praise our Lord and Savior! He keeps refining us.

#5 Lori Smith

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Posted 17 December 2012 - 03:33 PM

I love Charles Stanley. I like Chris Rice too. I also like to listen to Marty Goetz a messianic singer.

Praise God for His refining. When my heart and mind are confused, I lose my sense of discernment. I'm glad sanctification takes a lifetime! I'll need it!
In The Pursuit of God, A. W. Tozer writes, "Jesus taught that He wrought His works by always keeping His inward eyes upon His Father. His power lay in His continuous look at God (John 5:19-21)."

#6 Kevin Blankenship

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Posted 17 December 2012 - 06:33 PM

Yes, I should have indicated that there ARE some preachers who are on TV that are worth listening to. Adrien Rodgers, Charles Stanley, Carter Conlon to name a few. But if I see credit card icons at the bottom of the screen while a preacher is preaching about sewing your faith seed into his ministry......I see how fast I can change the channel. I'm usually not near as fast as i'd like to be.
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#7 Candice

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Posted 17 December 2012 - 08:23 PM

Betsy,
I love the writings of Watchman Nee, Tozer and others who are labeled "mystics". Here's what Tozer had to say about it:

“Some of my friends good-humoredly – and some a little bit severely – have called me a ‘mystic.’ Well I’d like to say this about any mysticism I may suppose to have. If an archangel from heaven were to come, and were to start giving me, telling me, teaching me, and giving me instruction, I’d ask him for the text. I’d say, ‘Where’s it say that in the Bible? I want to know.’ And I would insist that it was according to the scriptures, because I do not believe in any extra-scriptural teachings, nor any anti-scriptural teachings, or any sub-scriptural teachings. I think we ought to put the emphasis where God puts it, and continue to put it there, and to expound the scriptures, and stay by the scriptures. I wouldn’t – no matter if I saw a light above the light of the sun, I’d keep my mouth shut about it ’til I’d checked with Daniel and Revelation and the rest of the scriptures to see if it had any basis in truth. And if it didn’t, I’d think I’d just eaten something I shouldn’t, and I wouldn’t say anything about it. Because I don’t believe in anything that is unscriptural or that is anti-scripture.”
~~ A.W. Tozer

I have read Brother Lawrence too. Jean Guyon also. Yes, they're fine to a point. But, no, not exactly so in my spirit. There's just something about Guyon that seemed to glide into the new age (not called that in her era), but nonetheless, some aspects of her writings have that flavour to me.

So, I personally stick with Tozer above the rest. He refers to these mystics in his writings, but he never practiced Lectio Divina. More on this can be found at Berean Call:
http://www.theberean...atholic-mystics

I like Dave Hunt and Berean Call (Calvary Chapel guys) which promote discerning all things in scripture against what is written by others, especially those modern writers.

Hope this lends some help and makes some sense.

Love, Candice

#8 chipped china

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Posted 17 December 2012 - 11:27 PM

Yes it makes sense. I was taught well when I first accepted the Lord to discern everything with scripture. I am clearly not as well read as most of you here. It is by His grace and mercy that He gives me the Truth. The Lord has also allowed me to go through some trials by fire so I wouldn't be led astray.
My Lord shines His Light not me. Hallelujah!

#9 Kevin Blankenship

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Posted 18 December 2012 - 06:14 AM

A.W. Tozer certainly quotes Madame Guyon alot. And Brother Lawrence too. And Thomas a Kempis (Imitation of Christ). There is one article of Tozer's where he lists many of the authors whom he reads and admires. Whether he was actually a true Christian mystic or not, I guess, is a matter of how the word is defined and used. Or a matter of semantics.
I have read Brother Lawrence's book several times (it's not a large book) and it never failed to inspire me to seek a closer and more personal walk with Jesus, as I believe he had.
A.W. Tozer also read many authors who were of the Catholic belief and practice. But he wasn't a Catholic, but rather, an evangelistic. So I suppose that he could read many of the Christian mystics and not be one himself. If he was or if he wasn't, would not matter one iota to me. His writings, and his audio sermons have inspired me greatly to reach out towards God with more fervor and enthusiasm. I don't know....I just guess that I don't view Christian mysticism in the poor light that it is seen by some. In this day and age where it seems that most Christians are nominal only (just my opinion of observation) a little of the fervor of the old Christian mystics would be a refreshing burst of light in this dark (and growing darker) age in which we live, where the line of demarcation between a true believer and a nominal (in name only) believer is growing less and less defined. Just my opinion.
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#10 Lori Smith

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Posted 18 December 2012 - 06:56 AM

I agree. Tozer (who didn't even graduate from high school by the way) and others offer bits and tidbits written by mystics that fit in with an evangelical worldview. I see that done a lot. I guess that's how I see Christian mysticism. On that order I would consider myself a Christian mystic too. Every time I've actually started to read what some of the mystics have written, I think they are too far out for me. But when Tozer, and others who love to seek and practice God's presence, quote some of the orthodox quotes from the mystics, I like what I hear.

I think we've all read in different areas, and we all have unique ideas to bring to the table. I've had to read a lot because I'm in school. However, although it will be beneficial in the end, I have read my books that I would not have chosen. I certainly don't feel like what I've read has added one cubit to my stature. I believe what has really helped me grow, has been my willingness and desire to sit and listen to the Lord. Everyone on this board does that. God is the source of ALL wisdom. Much of what I've read that is considered scholarly, I would prefer to throw in the garbage because it is arrogant and blasphemous. JMHO
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In The Pursuit of God, A. W. Tozer writes, "Jesus taught that He wrought His works by always keeping His inward eyes upon His Father. His power lay in His continuous look at God (John 5:19-21)."

#11 Candice

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Posted 18 December 2012 - 07:42 AM

You all offer so much to this great post by Betsy.

I guess I like Tozer because he inspires me. This inspires me to read scripture and sit before the LORD in His presence. I agree with you Lori that most of what I read doesn't add one cubit to my stature. Well phrased!

One rabbit trail to add (for me) is that I find, almost exclusively, that the more current authors bring little to the table in terms of meat. In fact, most of their writings (that I've read anyway) seems quite watery and even "off". When Rick Warren came out with his Purpose Driven blah blah blah (IMO), I kind of stopped reading current authors. My sister is not a believer, but liked Warren's book because "it wasn't pushing Jesus down my throat. I just have to find my purpose". Oh my, I said nothing in response - really after years of witnessing to her, what can be said of that kind of writing that "inspires one to find their purpose"??? Of course, Warren must have some truth there or no one would read it. I don't, personally know what it inspires.
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#12 Kevin Blankenship

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Posted 18 December 2012 - 11:03 AM

Most of the current (Christian?) authors, especially the ones that end up on wal mart bookshelves ("Every day is Friday" comes to mind) just don't do anything for me. Most were shaped by the modern traditional church view. And many have grown famous by deviating and taling on a liberalistic view of even that.
But the old Puritan Divines (as they call them) write some deep stuff. Thomas Manton is a good one. The reason that I bought three of his books is because David Wilkerson said that his wife bought him the entire works of the man. That was good enough for me. Since I LOVE David Wilkerson and truly believe him to be a man of God. But each of us selects authors for a myriad of reasons. And I don't think that MY reasons are good and other's reasons are bad. I just don't give it THAT much thought. My reasoning is this: If Tozer, Wilkerson, Carter Conlon, etc etc likes to read them....that is enough validation for me. I can read those books and they might speak differently to me. I might put it on a shelf and won't touch it for a year.
A few years back, the late Leonard Ravenhill (a very fine and outstanding Christian man in my opinion) gave a list of books that he would strongly recommend. He did it live (on Youtube). I wrote every title down. And bought them. lol But Ravenhill believed strongly in Entire Sanctification, or Spiritual Perfection, and many of those books were about that subject.

#13 Candice

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Posted 18 December 2012 - 11:20 AM

I truly believe that Wilkerson, Conlin, et al were/are prophets in the sense that they offered heart-felt, accurate assessments of where we are all headed. My heart sings to the song tof Carter Conlin's recent sermon, A Guiding Voice in the Storm, December 2nd, http://www.tscnyc.or...?pg=sermons#top, is what I would see as prophetic and a man for that purpose. Yet, he tempers it with making it clear that what he sees, I guess prophetically, is serious without the annointing of the Holy Spirit.

As Betsy quoted in her original post here, "God shapes us through these people, the ones who ring true and the ones we reject. Why is it that certain prophets sing a song of God in our hearts and others are just good food?" I suppose we don't always know what it is, but the sense we have that something is true and echoes the Scripture is different as our walk with the LORD.
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#14 chipped china

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Posted 18 December 2012 - 04:59 PM

I'll listen later tonight. THanks

#15 chipped china

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 02:35 PM

Just got done listening to Conlin preach on the church of Laodicea. That's what we are known for: having so much therefore we are neither hot nor cold.
I for one I'm going to make sure He doesn't spit me from His mouth!!!!!!

#16 Charles Miles

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 03:16 PM

Let me ask a question here...Does anyone think there is anything wrong with being a Christian mystic? As I understand the definition, it means that one believes that our physical world is actually influenced or "driven" by the spiritual world. If that is essentially the definition of a mystic, then I`m going to have to go along with the mystics. Man does have some influence over a small number of physical happenings(not many) but effects the spiritual world by repentance, prayer, and confessing Jesus as Lord of the man`s life. At the birth of Christ here on earth, heaven and earth met over a small town in Judea....now how mystic is that? Heaven opened and some shepherds got to look upon an angelic host singing in the heavens...proclaiming the birth of a savior for man! I guess one can take mystic to mean a bunch of things that Tozer didn`t believe, but it would be ver hard to be a true child of God with a relationship with Him, and not be at least part mystic. Am I mistaken here?
If I am wrong here, please someone straighten me out.

A brother in Christ with a serious question,

Charlie
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#17 chipped china

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 03:34 PM

You make perfect sense to me but I am hoping an elder will expound on this more deeply. I just know that God has allowed me to experience some mystical things like the filling of the Holy Spirit. feeling His Holy Presence. Faith is mystical because it's a gift from God, lest no one should boast. I've experience a healing anointed by the Holy Spirit. If you've ever had to fight Satan, that is certainly a mystical experience and when Christ in you wins that is most certainly mystical. We know there is earth and all of His creation, but we are also warned about the world and told to come out of it. When my mind
makes a reality shift or has an epiphany from the way I thought reality was, that mystical. It's a gift from God purifying me, anointing me into His Kingdom.
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#18 Candice

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 06:26 PM

Hi Charles!

I guess the word "mystic" isn't in the bible; therefore, it doesn't exist!! The word "bible" isn't there either, but it exists. This is just a JOKE. Because, a pastor said that the rapture is a complete lie because the word isn't in the bible! How funny, silly and ridiculous we humans are in the flesh!

I agree with you and hear your concerns brother. I think I am a "wanna-be mystic". I really COVET that life in Christ. I do not claim to have it in my complete grasp. Sometimes, that life with Christ is there on my fingertips, sometimes on my palm, sometimes in cupped hand. But, as of yet, not fully grasped.

To be a mystic, does this not mean, at some point, not reading Tozer, et al?? But instead, to trust in the word of God and the Holy Spirit only? Now, we all know here that Tozer was not very sociable and claimed himself to have lived a lonely life. At some point, we just trust completely. I want to BE a mystic - not just read about it and hope!

So, I guess I'm a mystic-in-the-making and that is what I asked the LORD - the desire of my heart to know HIM more.

Blessings,
Candice
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#19 Candice

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 06:29 PM

Just got done listening to Conlin preach on the church of Laodicea. That's what we are known for: having so much therefore we are neither hot nor cold.
I for one I'm going to make sure He doesn't spit me from His mouth!!!!!!

Betsy,
The LORD will not spit you out of His mouth! You aren't lukewarm; that's for sure. We are all on the road and HE knows our hearts sister!
Love,
Canidce
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#20 Candice

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Posted 19 December 2012 - 06:31 PM

Faith is mystical because it's a gift from God, lest no one should boast.


AMEN!